The rule at our park is very simple. "No unattended dogs outside." This means that if you leave your campsite, you must take your dogs with you or put them inside your RV. This is not an insurance thing for us; it is a matter of safety for the dogs and to avoid the nuisance of barking dogs every time someone walks down the lane in front of the dogs, especially if they are walking their own dog. I have seen dogs left unattended outside and tied to a picnic table or a tree in 100+ degree weather with no food or water for hours and have personally gone to the site to give the dogs water, to untangle their leash, and/or to move them to a shaded area until the owners return. I feel like shooting those owners when they return. Doug
QUOTE(Parkview @ Aug 11 2009, 11:53 AM) [snapback]18248[/snapback] The rule at our park is very simple. "No unattended dogs outside." This means that if you leave your campsite, you must take your dogs with you or put them inside your RV. This is not an insurance thing for us; it is a matter of safety for the dogs and to avoid the nuisance of barking dogs every time someone walks down the lane in front of the dogs, especially if they are walking their own dog. I have seen dogs left unattended outside and tied to a picnic table or a tree in 100+ degree weather with no food or water for hours and have personally gone to the site to give the dogs water, to untangle their leash, and/or to move them to a shaded area until the owners return. I feel like shooting those owners when they return. Doug I couldn't agree with you more in both cases. In the latter, I'd even supply you with the bullets.
There you go, no CG owner is smarter than Doug, so he has the best definition. Unless a CG explicitly says that unattended also means inside RV, it would be reasonable to assume Doug's rule. It is also reasonable to assume that pet owners should be responsible enough to NOT leave their dogs inside ALL day. Our dog will be inside for one hour only, one time only, on any trip, while we go to church. You can tell he's glad to see us go (he knows he's going to have some quiet time), and I always ask the neighbors if any problems. This dog is well in excess of 100 lbs, spends most of his time outside when we are at the site, and a lot of people don't even know we have a dog with us until they see us walking him. He only barks if stranger (or loose dog) comes into our site.
No, I did not think I would spark this much conversation, so thank you for all the replies! It occurred to me that maybe a CG owner leaves this one rule vague on purpose. For example, if the rule simply states "no dogs to be left unattended" with no mention of inside or outside, and I leave mine unattended inside and they do not make a peep, then maybe most CG owners are fine with that. However, under the same rule, if my dogs are left unattended inside and they bark like fools all day, then the owner can show me the rule and have grounds for kicking me out if they so choose. However, if the rule states "no dogs are to be left unattended OUTSIDE" and my dog barks all day unattended INSIDE, then I can argue that I have not broken any rules, and kicking me out would be more complicated. If the rule states "no dogs are to be left unattended INSIDE or OUTSIDE" then the CG owner risks losing the business of dog-owners who might call ahead and ask about the rule and choose to go elsewhere, when in fact these people might have been very good customers (clearly they are concerned with following rules, hence the call) with quiet dogs who might have never caused a problem anyway. Today I left my dogs unattended inside for part of the day and when I returned the neighbor said "Oh! I forgot you had dogs, they are so quiet." I was careful to clean up all the poop when I took the dogs, leashed of course, on their walk, and was careful not to cut thru other people's sites. I did not cut down any trees, or wash my dishes in the restroom, or repair the camper onsite. I even was careful to drive 5.5 MPH. I hope I am forgiven.
Nicki, I loved your post. I think the first paragraph was right on, and I laughed out loud when I read the second one. You are definitely a camp owner's dream!
B) Please allow me to to quote our entire rule pertaining to Pets: "RV'ers with Pets Your pets are welcome here, but please keep them on a leash and clean up after them. Owners and pets that bark or otherwise disturb others will be asked to leave. NO UNATTENDED DOGS OUTSIDE!" The last part about the "unattended dogs outside" was added after we had been open for a couple of years and was added for a reason. The main rule would take care of barking dogs inside the rig, and the "unattended outside" addition takes care of the rest. Bottom line - we love pets unless they disturb other campers and/or lead to complaints. Thanks to all of you for understanding of the point of view of park owners and other campers. Doug
I know that this topic will prompt me to ASK that question when we check into a park. IF they will not allow us to leave our 100+ pound dog inside, unattended, while we go to dinner, or see the local sights, then we will just stay elsewhere. There are just too many other RV Parks out there to choose from and it is not practical for us to take a dog that size into WalMart with us. Obviously we cannot leave her in the car while we eat, or purchase groceries either. I'm not looking to go against any Park owner that has set his rules. He has his own reasons, and I respect that. By the same token, it is my money, and I hope that they understand when I just turn around and leave their place and give my money to another park.
Although this topic has been beaten to death let me add one more possible issue. Many States, (AZ, CA, IL, ME, MD, MN, NV, NH, NJ, ND, SD, VT, and WV) have laws against leaving an animal unattended in a vehicle and far more localities have similar laws. In fact people have been convicted of cruelty under the anti-cruelty law in States that don't have specific vehicle ordnances. Granted most, but not all of these laws, have a presumption that the animal is in danger such as no air conditioning. In fact at least two States that I am aware of MD and VT and maybe others encourage their citizens to call 911 in the case of an unattended animal in a vehicle. Now of course I understand that if we can't agree on what the word unattended means many will argue that their RV isn't a vehicle so the laws won't apply to them. Although that doesn't seem to work in traffic court. http://www.animallaw.info/articles/qvuspetsincars.htm has a quick summary of various State laws.
Quoted from the animal law website: "The next factor important to the question is the condition under which the the animal is left in the vehicle. Most of these laws provide that the animal must be confined or unattended in a parked or stationary vehicle. Further, the laws add that in order for a person to violate the law, the conditions have to endanger the animal's life. Some of the statutes specifically state that extreme hot or cold temperatures, lack of adequate ventilation, or failing to provide proper food or drink meet this definition. Other laws are more vague and just require that the conditions are such that physical injury or death is likely to result." I think every person who has said they leave their dog in the camper has also mentioned that they do so with care, i.e. making sure it isn't too hot, making sure they leave water, even leaving a blanket for them to curl up in if it is cold, checking back often if it is hot. I think we've satisfactorily covered safety of the dog. I assure you (as I volunteer for my local humane society which does cruelty/rescue cases daily) that the dogs who come in off the rescue van are not spoiled little Fifi's (like mine) who have been rescued from their fate of having to wait an hour or two for their dinner while their owner is out antiquing. The dogs who are rescued are severely underweight, ribs poking out, covered in ticks, fleas, cuts, injuries, collars embedded into their skin from being left on their entire leves, etc. Anyone who expects an animal rescue agency to use their time and resources to rescue the typical Fifi who has been left in a typical camper while their owner is out sightseeing is being silly. We are not talking animal cruelty here. Note: Names have been changed to protect the innocent. Neither of my dogs are named Fifi.
When I provided the link to the animals in vehicles laws I was not saying that leaving a pet in an RV is cruel, I do it myself. I am worried about the possibility of someone well meaning or not calling 911 to report an unattended animal as some States and many local jurisdictions encourage. A careful reading of the laws indicates that some States allow the police, animal control officers and even in some cases rescue society officers to use whatever force required to verify the condition of the animal. This includes forcing doors or breaking windows if necessary. Is it likely to happen to an RV? Of course not. Is it possible? Yes. If the police receive a call they may feel that they must verify that the animal is or is not in danger to close out the call.
Oh my goodness! My head is spinning! Nikki what have you done? My husband and I bought our camper this summer just because we adopted a new dog and wanted to take her on vacation with us! I was so much happier when I was ignorant :lol: . I interpreted "unattended" as left outside with no one around. When we take our girls to the pool or to any of the other activities around the campground we first walk our dog to give her some exercise and take care of her toileting needs. We then put her in her crate where she feels safe and usually takes a nap until we come back. None of the activities last more than an hour or two and as expected, our dog is usually yawning and stretching when we come back and wake her up. I was under the impression that RVing it was the was to go if you have a dog, now I'm nervous.
coacbcps, Don't get nervous. We, too, bought our RV so that we could take our animals with us, and I promise you we have never had a problem anywhere. I think noreaster's post (#14) pretty well sums it up. Most cg owners will not say anything as long as the pet is not barking and/or disturbing other campers in some way. If it does then the owner can enforce the rule to resolve the problem. I'm not saying you should purposely break the rules, but it seems like many places sort of go by "don't ask, don't tell" unless a problem arises.
I second Texasrvers. Don't worry. Back in the day when we traveled with a pooch...we would do the same as you noted. Good long walks to exercise and take care of business. Then she was more than happy to snuggle onto the hide-a-bed couch and sleep the day away inside the cool, quiet RV. She would pout (you can always tell a dog pout) for days after we'd get back from a camping trip. No more sleeping on a couch when we were at work! :lol: Nope: the backyard bean-bag had to make do again...until the next trip!
When I started this topic, it was because I had been reprimanded by a CG owner for leaving my dogs inside the camper, and he only knew because they had barked when they heard him performing the honey cart service. Since then, I have been paying attention to CG rules regarding leaving your dogs unattended. We are on a month-long road trip, and have stayed at six campgrounds since my original post. Each one has had the rule of "Don't leave dogs unattended" (no mention of inside or out) and at each CG we have gone on day trips without the dogs, with no problems. The weather had been cool until now. Where we are now, we have an 11-hour tour offsite (NYC) scheduled today and it is supposed to be 92 degrees out, obviously way too long and hot to trust the A/C won't blip out. We inquired to see if the CG offered a dog-walking service, or could recommend a boarding kennel. They do in fact offer a dog walking service--they are coming for two walks and also checking in periodically to verify the A/C is working. I am thrilled. They are not even making $$ from this--when I paid for this service, it went straight into the KOA cancer camp donation tube. Their rules do state "No dog to be left unattended." My dogs will be "tended to" and the CG owner is clearly OK w/it. He said they've been walking dogs all summer long for people who go on this tour. If your dogs are the kind that bark incessantly when you are gone, you might have a problem. There is a product that I have seen--it looks like a baby monitor and it is supposed to send out some sort of signal that makes dogs not bark. It seems humane. I have no idea how or if it works, but it supposedly has a large radius so you can even use it to control your neighbor's dogs--maybe something no camper should be without!! I really do think the CG owners only want peace and quiet. If you leave your dog unattended I think it is OK as long as they are not a nuisance. I have been in probably about 25 different CG's, all across the USA, all with 2 dogs in tow, and only had a problem at the aforementioned one, and that CG was creepy anyway so I kind of want to say I don't care about that one. All in all, I couldn't imagine camping without my 2 dogs, almost as much as I couldn't imagine camping without my 2 kids. One major draw of camping for us is the fact that we can take our dogs. I think many many families feel the same way, and CG owners recognize this. Just bring your rabies/vet records in case something comes up where you need to board them for a long outing.
Our camper has sat out front of our house since we arrived home late Saturday night. Sunday morning, I put both airs on to cool it while unloading. I set the temp to 74 degrees. After unloading, I turned them off. Yesterday, early evening, I had to go get something I forgot. Out of curiosity, I used the remote to check the temp. It was 88 degrees. The outside temp had been close to 90 most of the day. And no, my pets were not in the camper. They were in the house with me. All it has is a couple of window units and a fan - no central air.
Nicki, Thanks for your follow up. It is great when a park has a walking service like you described. I've said before that we have not had any problems with our animals, but I would gladly pay for this type of service if I ever needed it. You also mention a VERY important point. People who travel with animals should always carry a copy of the pet's vaccination records because you never know when you might need them. We had copies made and keep them in a drawer in the motorhome. One time when we were on a trip we needed to put our coach in the repair shop overnight. That meant we had to board our pet. The kennel required proof of vaccination which we did have with us. It sure made things a lot easier.
We were at a campground last month that not only required proof of vaccination, but actually made a copy of my records and kept them.
Last year while camping in Arizona, we wanted to take the train and stay overnight at the lodge near the rim of the Grand Canyon. The lodge did not take dogs but there was a boarding kennel at the train station that did so we called to make the arrangements. We had our vet records, but could not do the overnight trip at all because our dogs had not had the bordatella vaccine (they were current on everything else.) We did the day trip instead of the overnight to the canyon (left the dogs in the camper--it was cool out, and if I remember correctly that CG had a dog-walking service too) and felt very rushed. We were very disapointed that we could not do the overnight outing, all for one immunization we had missed. After the fact, our vet said that it is very uncommon for a place to require the bordatella vaccine. She said it is only 40% effective and the trend among vets is to phase it out. But we got it this year anyway just in case. So, just a tip to be extra-prepared when traveling with pets!
QUOTE(nicki @ Aug 19 2009, 07:05 AM) [snapback]18436[/snapback] Last year while camping in Arizona, we wanted to take the train and stay overnight at the lodge near the rim of the Grand Canyon. The lodge did not take dogs but there was a boarding kennel at the train station that did so we called to make the arrangements. We had our vet records, but could not do the overnight trip at all because our dogs had not had the bordatella vaccine (they were current on everything else.) We did the day trip instead of the overnight to the canyon (left the dogs in the camper--it was cool out, and if I remember correctly that CG had a dog-walking service too) and felt very rushed. We were very disapointed that we could not do the overnight outing, all for one immunization we had missed. After the fact, our vet said that it is very uncommon for a place to require the bordatella vaccine. She said it is only 40% effective and the trend among vets is to phase it out. But we got it this year anyway just in case. So, just a tip to be extra-prepared when traveling with pets! Just for what it is worth, we have boarded at three different places in the past year, including the kennels at WDW Fort Wilderness, (which are run by a contractor, NOT run by WDW, BTW), and all required Bordatella.
We travel with 2 labs and stay mostly in public parks and in KOA's if they have a fenced off-leash area which is heaven. "Unattended" has always meant to us outside the camper without supervision. If we are going to be away from the rig for over 2 hours, we generally will talk to a friendly neighbor about any concerns they may have and give them a phone #. We have found that most RV'ers in our age group (retired) travel with dogs and there is some leeway given so long as you are tidy and reasonable about managing them. If we are in a family type campground, we expect there will be kids who make noise and cry and yell and poke each other--we don't go complaining. It is disappointing when a park turns into a restricted condo development or something and the rules are burdensome. We avoid that. It's also disappointing when people are rude to each other and don't reason things out--if we wanted that we could just hang out with our family!
